Dialogue means accommodation and dialogue is the key

Miracles don’t happen so often. We will have to strive for the goal with a positive approach. No hegemonies, no diktats, let it be everyone’s voice that must matter. Prof. Abdul Gani Bhat, a senior Hurriyat Leader, in an exclusive interview with ZULFIKAR MAJID.

How do you view present situation in Jammu and Kashmir?

I’m not an analyst, but in terms of politics, I’m an eyewitness to peoples’ glances, shrugs and chance remarks. These glances, shrugs and chance remarks are more revealing than many articles writers produced on Kashmir. If you interpret these glances, shrugs and chance remarks, I trust you can hear the cry of the soul of Kashmir. You can locate in the depth of the soul of the Kashmir, the sentiment. When you talk with reference to current uprising at the peoples’ level, I will give you four elements which need to be addressed by India, Pakistan and by Kashmiri leadership primarily.a) The sentiment is alive and kicking. The sentiment that no Kashmiri will accept Indian political hegemony. b) The youth who were born amidst the roar of the gun, constituted the frontline in the recent uprising which means that sentiment has been transferred from older generation to younger one. That means sentiment is alive for tomorrow also. But for India, it is a huge problem which needs attention. c) Kashmiris are caught up in conflict situation and political hegemony of the India is not acceptable to Kashmiri ethos. But at the same time he recognizes that he lives in India. Therefore he has to strike either a balance or work out an adjustability and adaptability whereby he can fight and live together. To mix up these two is a gigantic task to any community. d) The divide between Jammu and Kashmir is total. It is regionally, politically, economically and unfortunately religiously too. This has to be addressed.

In clear terms tell us what is the sentiment of a common Kashmiri?

I repeat, Kashmiris consider that they are the master of their destiny and are the final arbitrators of their fate.

Are they fighting against Indian rule in Kashmir?

To be straight, yes off course, because India made promises to the people of Kashmir. The promises were honored more in breach rather than in observance.

Is session or Azadi from India achievable?

This is a different proposition. I talked with reference to the questions you asked. When you ask me are they fighting Indian rule, I said yes. But is Azadi achievable or not, is entirely a different proposition. What is achievable and what is not achievable is entirely a different proposition which in an answer to a question of a journalist is not possible to give.

Then what for Hurriyat Conference is fighting of which you were chairman and now a senior leader?

If you draw lines on running water, you can never come up with a picture. In politics 2+2, they say never makes 4, but less than 5 and more than 3. But in my politics 2+2 makes 4 and just 4. I consider that nuclear weaponasation of India and Pakistan has entirely changed the situation in the sub-continent. In this regard, we have to understand that war between India and Pakistan is never possible now. And if is the situation, what we can do next. Armed struggle. But for it you need to garner supporter at international level. But in my opinion I suspect we can’t get it and if we can’t get it, probably with armed struggle you can’t get desired results. So armed struggle no solution, war no solution, what do you next. Dialogue. In a dialogue, the principle is, you accommodate the other party. I accommodate you, you accommodate me. Accommodation is the principle. You have to rise above your traditional position on an issue where you believe you can reach the compromise. And that compromise is that Kashmiri wants an acceptable, honorable and durable solution of the problem.

You people were engaged in a dialogue with New Delhi for years. What was the end result?

Smiles. Well those who talk in terms of UN Security Council resolutions have been waiting for last six decades, nothing happened. Not a single resolution was implemented in 61 years. How come we could work wonders in one or two meetings with the Government of India or the Government of Pakistan. Dialogue is a process and a process is a process which continues till you achieve your target. And I say it is a dialogue which probably can produce a compromising solution.

But why did dialogue process broke down?

No process has broken down, because India and Pakistan are talking. And they aren’t talking weather, but Kashmir. Kashmir constitutes a potential threat to nuclear peace in sub-continent. The Indians and Pakistanis are caught up in the situation where they have to talk and come up with solution.

But will it be acceptable to the people of Kashmir?

When we talk about the aspirations of Kashmir we talk about the aspirations of people of Jammu, Ladakh and the valley. Aspirations are fractured. Some of us seek accession with Pakistan, some independence and some like Farooq Abdullah and others seek India. They are Kashmiris. Aren’t they? So there is not a single voice as a matter of principle. Discordant voices as far aspirations go. And therefore when we talk of Kashmir, considering the contradiction, it is a compromise formula which will work. That is how I look at it, I may be wrong.

Are you ready to enter into a dialogue with New Delhi again?

If you ask me, I’ve no problem. Sanity demands that I should be talking. When I know that no military solution is available with me, when I know UN resolutions aren’t implemented, when I know India and Pakistan are talking, I should be talking.

What is the reason you people aren’t talking?

This is an issue which involves strategy. If we aren’t talking, we in matter of fact are impressing the leadership in New Delhi and Islamabad that we want a meaningful, purposeful and productive dialogue.

OK, coming to Hurriyat unification proposal. Where does it stand now?

Well the unity is what everybody would want to happen. But it can’t happen in a vacuum. You have to do the talking and sorting out issues. Issues that separate you or that sometimes probably make you speak what you never should. While sorting out issues, you have to agree on amicable minimum political programme. And if you can do it, unity is possible. And unity is what everybody would love to see happening in Kashmir at Hurriyat level.We should work hard for unity, but hegemony is never acceptable to all of us.

Hegemony from which side?

Any side. Umar Farooq’s side, Geelani Sahib’s side, Yasin Malik’s side. Hegemony isn’t acceptable. Collectivism in politics in need of the hour.

Was hegemony the reason for Hurriyat breakup?

One of the reasons, no doubt it.

From which side?

Well I don’t want to go to the sides of the episode which happened a few years back. Don’t flock the dead horses that will give you nothing. I think we should move forward towards brighter tomorrow rather than talk about yesterday’s darkness.

Is there any timeframe for unity?

Difficult to say, a week, a month or more than it. It is situational. If a situation develops favoring unity, it must happen. But if it develops against it, it may take more time.

Coming to recent huge protest rallies in Kashmir. Prof Bhat was missing.

Yes I was missing. No doubt about it. But silence sometimes speaks more than louder voices in streets. Hurriyat was represented by none other than its chairman Mirwaiz Umar. Hurriyat was represented by a team nominated for Coordination Committee. I was not a member of it. I would therefore not be with them. But there was no bar either for me to be with them. I was involved politically and intellectually. I ask you a question. Was whole Kashmir on roads? And those who didn’t come out, were they not involved? If my son or daughter was involved, I was there and if my chairman was involved, I was there very much. Entire leadership is not required to represent the forum in an agitation or uprising. It isn’t done anywhere in the world. I’m the author of the agenda which Hurriyat gave after economic blockade of the Valley. The agenda was that if Jammu people of two and half district seek separate state, we have no problem. They implemented economic blockade, and we in exercise of our right to live talked about alternative route, Muzafferabad Chalo. Then we also talked about alternative market, Rawalpindi.

Was this agenda set by Prof Bhat?

Yes. We were in a meeting and some people said we should carry out a dialogue. I said this is traditional politics, we should produce an agenda which should look revolutionary.

Was Hurriyat leadership ready for the situation which arose after economic blockade?

I don’t think. No leaders expected the upsurge so massive as it turned out to be. Events overtook the leadership and that is why they couldn’t give movement a direction and fix the targets.

What should be the strategy now?

I think leadership is aware of the hazards. We have taken on India which is world’s second largest country. It is a huge adventure. I won’t call it a mis-adventure, but it is an adventure. To win, we need a strategy. I think entire leadership should join heads together, workout a strategy and implement it as effectively as they should.

What is your say about elections?

Election for us is a non-issue. We seek a settlement of the dispute.

What about holding of elections under neutral observers?

We have to draw a line between an election and a plebiscite. Election is a democratic process as far as government formation is concerned and plebiscite is a democratic exercise as far as future dispensation of Kashmir is concerned. The people of J&K have been fighting for plebiscite not for elections. We are ready for any elections under any neutral organization like SAARC, ASEAN or Common Wealth or United Nations any time.

What is the practicable solution of Kashmir?

I think general (Parvez Musharaf) gave us a good idea. He said if you can implement four-point formula in step by step manner, we could reach to a stage where we can workout a permanent solution of K-dispute.

Do you accept that gun played a role in highlighting Kashmir issue?

Yes, no doubt it. Gun created a roar and it was heard all over. People focused on Kashmir. But now we can’t garner the global support for gun. For any movement in world you need three elements. One is Hulchul, which is where the movement is launched, there has to be some uprising, some expression of anger and some manifestation of alienation. Second you should enjoy support at global level and three is that doors for talks should never be closed.

People say that Hurriyat leaders demand Azadi from India, but are themselves living under security provided by the India?

(Smiles). Leader isn’t a rare commodity. All governments wherever you go ensure the safety of not only leadership but all people. But leaders are more exposed to dangers and therefore more care is taken by the governments. There are (security) men around the leaders in Kashmir, but they don’t deter them from their advancement towards their destination.

One of the failures of Hurriyat is that it couldn’t take care of orphans, widows and destitute of militancy?

There is bound to be what you call inadequacies or glaring weakness in forum politics. Inherent weaknesses in forum politics. If you say you should have been running an office like secretariat, it was not possible because of many reasons. We are doing our little bit whatever we can do. Whatever little we have or we can, we do it. Probably doing it as generously as you can.

There are allegation from certain quarters that Hurriyat receives massive funds from different counties, but they never utilize it for the purpose they have been sent.

There are organizations which have been banned by the Government of India. No donations can reach to such organization. Even if this is conceived as a matter of argument, yes, they have money. Where does the money come from isn’t my problem. Do they squander the money or spend it on organizational matters, on political and diplomatic exercises and peoples welfare, yes they are doing it. And if there are any mishaps or mistakes, I would only want that such mistakes should never ever happen.

Your message for youth of Kashmir.

The youth is my future and I was my youth to use their brain and shine like stars do on the skies.